tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post726607530008599391..comments2022-03-29T04:28:17.248-07:00Comments on Dale Fincher: Apologetics Study Bible releasedDale Fincherhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-21853209893039136862008-01-05T18:02:00.000-08:002008-01-05T18:02:00.000-08:00Thanks, Mark 16:15 Ministries, for your gracious c...Thanks, Mark 16:15 Ministries, for your gracious comment. I appreciate that.<BR/><BR/>I must say that I find it completely the opposite than what you suggest. The problems I raised are not better suited for the academy as they are problems and issues I'm finding on the street, 'doing ministry' and working with people of all ages who are thoughtful humans trying to make sense of things. I've been out of the academy for several years now and focusing more poignantly on what it means to be appropriately human as an integrationist.<BR/><BR/>On the areas of gender, the popular evangelical church is confused. We are finding casualties leaving the church over it because some other religions are more charitable toward women (i.e. wicca). In areas of evangelism and practical apologetics, I would find this very important. This isn't an academic problem. It's an everyday cultural problem that is flying under the radar of many 'leaders.'<BR/><BR/>Some of the issues in the Apologetics Study Bible I do not encounter on the street. So the irony is that this Study Bible may actually be more academic than even my criticism. Lay people read plenty more in works of imagination than they do in philosophy, yet there's little time spent on the value or importance of apologetically developing a Christian imagination (which is why I mention the tradition of this Bible is outside the Chesterton/Lewis tradition--which is the most popular apologetics tradition in terms of books sold--men whose work on apologetics were outside the academy). So in short, I do think my criticisms were actually directed at those debates and concerns that are outside of the academy rather than those in it. As I said in my view, evangelicals aren't strong in those areas and so we dismiss them. And I think it's a poor reflection on who we are and what we stand for.<BR/><BR/>I'm unsure what you mean by the second half of your post. Maybe I'm misreading it, but are you suggesting heretical views should be allowed to defend themselves in a work like this? Maybe you can clarify that.<BR/><BR/>Thanks again, for your gracious post. And thanks for reading!Dale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-37979928983592770002008-01-04T15:14:00.000-08:002008-01-04T15:14:00.000-08:00Dale, Your insightful analysis of the Apologet...Dale,<BR/> Your insightful analysis of the Apologetics Study Bible were transparent and honest. I do not believe the general public however is struggling with the same issues you are, and I am sure you are well aware of that. The issues you raised were ones of integrity and well-taken, but probably fit better in the academic class setting than a Study Bible.<BR/> My observation of the Bible were the notes should have been broader in comprehension to include writings, references and arguments from the sources outside traditional orthodoxy, at least to defend themselves, as remember until 300 AD there was no orthodoxy in place. Many Christians 100-300 AD were Arians, strict monotheistics (from Jewish heritage) and various other persuasions. Adding to that, many revered Church Fathers (Origin et al) were heretics in their own right in some of their views, so why hold them up in such high esteem as definers of orthodoxy? It would seem to me the Deity of Christ, Blood of Christ, Repentance, Baptism, Holy Spirit, Millenialism and literal Bible hermeneutic are the stable ingredients in early Christianity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-88317292617806043702007-10-12T15:39:00.000-07:002007-10-12T15:39:00.000-07:00Mstr Luke...An interesting point that we'd do well...Mstr Luke...<BR/><BR/>An interesting point that we'd do well to consider in the conversation on gender. <BR/><BR/>And, yes, I'm with you on American apologetics... we can be fuller and freer. But that's a cool thing... we at least know we can be fuller and freer. So let's move in that direction.<BR/><BR/>Capt SoloDale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-77195600381100983292007-10-12T15:22:00.000-07:002007-10-12T15:22:00.000-07:00Hey Dale, thanks for the work reviewing the book. ...Hey Dale, <BR/><BR/>thanks for the work reviewing the book. you are right that it manifests the typical perspective on American apologetics, and it certainly has its strengths. <BR/><BR/>It could have been so much richer, fuller, better, more beautiful and truthful.<BR/><BR/>Are we aiming too low, here, as evangelical apologists? Its like we're stale and blind...<BR/><BR/>The gender stuff irks me to no end. When that gets intertwined in the Trinity, it is a BIG stumbling block. How is Jesus God's SON? Why would I want him to be my husband? And I am supposed to support a Constitutional Amendment banning gay marriage? This reading of the ESCHATON mandates gay marriage. Talk about apparent incoherence.<BR/><BR/>Thanks for letting me rant a bit,<BR/><BR/>Mstr LukeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-43565195371090329762007-10-09T08:45:00.000-07:002007-10-09T08:45:00.000-07:00I posted on my blog a short story that I wrote. It...I posted on my blog a short story that I wrote. It's still in the process of being revised, but I thought you might like it. CHeck it out if you want.Philiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00446429741352832326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-59064626366133535612007-10-03T08:43:00.000-07:002007-10-03T08:43:00.000-07:00i agree. And you can refer to your other sources ...i agree. And you can refer to your other sources to go deeper.<BR/><BR/>This is fantastic for those who have never studied apologetics before. It'll open their eyes to the controversies as well as how talk about them.Dale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-49226317967749860222007-10-03T08:41:00.000-07:002007-10-03T08:41:00.000-07:00I probably am going to get it for the very reason ...I probably am going to get it for the very reason that it has so much in one source. I have multiple commentaries and books, but its frustrating to have to spend more time finding things that bring light then actually studying what people say about it. It will definitely be a good source.Philiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00446429741352832326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-71868324847194449172007-10-03T07:15:00.000-07:002007-10-03T07:15:00.000-07:00Philip,I do believe it handles problem texts well,...Philip,<BR/><BR/>I do believe it handles problem texts well, at least the ones I've looked at so far, particularly the discrepancies around the resurrection.<BR/><BR/>As I said earlier, I think this would be a great reference piece as it puts a lot of tools in the same place. And while I think they are weak in gender, I do believe the most critical aspects of this work were compiled by some of the best in evangelicalism. So it is scholarly and not simply stereo-typical, worn-out, rhetorical replies.<BR/><BR/>I think you should get it, Philip. You'll like it!Dale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-43314337562929527562007-10-03T06:20:00.000-07:002007-10-03T06:20:00.000-07:00Yes I have read that article. The topic was very i...Yes I have read that article. The topic was very interesting to me, and it does start to open up the general issue of gender. However, the article, as you said, doesn't deal primarily with that. I'll have to reread it though to refresh myself with what you two said.<BR/><BR/>My main question about this Bible would be: how does it deal with problematic passages? There are plenty of passages in Scripture that people view contradictory and purely wrong. Does it deal with such passages well?Philiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00446429741352832326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-2121632722663625782007-10-01T08:09:00.000-07:002007-10-01T08:09:00.000-07:00Philip, who is this 'someone' you are referring to...Philip, who is this 'someone' you are referring to? ;)<BR/><BR/>Have you seen our Unmuted article? While it isn't spelling out how gender is revealed in God, it does point out stereo-types and inconsistencies in the evangelical church regarding gender 'roles.' Here it is: http://unmuted.soulation.org.Dale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-17778628269801458612007-10-01T04:06:00.000-07:002007-10-01T04:06:00.000-07:00Sounds like someone needs to write an article abou...Sounds like someone needs to write an article about gender in the Bible and the proper, Biblical way to view male and female. Just a thought.Philiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00446429741352832326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-7744171676542400632007-09-29T12:03:00.000-07:002007-09-29T12:03:00.000-07:00Paul, you are correct. The very reasoning isn't s...Paul, you are correct. The very reasoning isn't solid. And, on my view, is part of the reason I disagree with the typical conclusion in the gender debate.<BR/><BR/>To say that God is male is difficult to take and not well argued (one of the difficulties of a work like this Study Bible is that space is limited). We can use male gendered words, but to say that God is male is problematic on many counts, most importantly, how it leaves women as image bearers of God as well as the feminine qualities God also possesses in the Scripture, like metaphors of child bearing and huddling young under his wings.<BR/><BR/>They should have used better qualified apologists in the actual gender debate deal with this issue (just like they brought in Phil Johnson and Bill Dempski for the ID issue).<BR/><BR/>After all, we are looking to give a sound answer to the arguments against the Christian faith. There were no philosophical arguments undergirding the gender issue here, only certain interpretations of texts, some of which was based on speculation. <BR/><BR/>Because we encounter women who find the Christian faith intelligently lacking in this area, I would expect better in this study Bible which would be addressing the issues of our time.<BR/><BR/>But as I said in my review, there are many good things about this Study Bible and many great names contributing. It is good to see some philosophers and theologians actually working together. That's refreshing.Dale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-67171893356357878262007-09-29T08:49:00.000-07:002007-09-29T08:49:00.000-07:00Would you say your biggest complaint is how they a...Would you say your biggest complaint is <I>how</I> they argue for their conclusion on the gender issues and not necessarily the conclusion they come to? I know you disagree with the conclusion, but there are probably many other issues where you disagree with the conclusion. I take it that it's the neglect of good arguments against their own that you find troublesome. Is that correct? (And by 'they' I mean the author(s) of the relevant sections <I>and</I> the editors.)@wpaulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05852938742660699387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-60676465567534992092007-09-28T07:31:00.000-07:002007-09-28T07:31:00.000-07:00Hey Jimmy... yeah, it depends on what you're looki...Hey Jimmy... yeah, it depends on what you're looking for. There's a lot of great resources here in one place. I think the verse-by-verse commentary is alone worth it as a reference work.<BR/><BR/>But you are right, even the best resources can never be exhaustive and everyone beings their own theological framework to the table. But it is great to know the different sides as we grow to think like Jesus.Dale Fincherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01731582817969852733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7288412825716153111.post-80804822098513983402007-09-28T06:12:00.000-07:002007-09-28T06:12:00.000-07:00Thanks for your comments on the Apologetics Bible....Thanks for your comments on the Apologetics Bible. I have considered buying it, but now I may go and look first. I will probably buy it, but your comments have helped me to understand that there are many other nuances of questions and answers that even the best resource by itself cannot treat effectively.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com